So today I came across a guest post on Football Perspective from some guy named Brad Oremland who ranked literally over 100 NFL QBs. Good for Brad, he wasted almost as much time as I do keeping track of Bill Belichick’s hoodies.
You can go fish for it if you feel like torturing yourself, but let me spoil the mystery, he’s got Peyton Manning at number one. I could go through and poke all the holes in that one, but Tom Brady’s number seven ranking is so riddled with bias and omissions I had to go through it piece by piece.
I’m not one for rankings because really, like 90% of twitter and social media is people arguing about who is better than who. Everyone has their guy and no one is going to be convinced. Personally I prefer to live in a world where athletes can be great and there doesn’t need to be a consensus on who is the better of the two. It’s all arbitrary and personal choice and a waste of time going head-to-head with Bob from Indianapolis trying to convince him Brady is better than Manning.
All I know is that I wouldn’t trade being a fan of Tom Brady’s career for any other QB in NFL history, for whatever that counts for.
So let’s see how Brad dismissed Tom Brady…
My comments are in bold, obvs – MD
7. Tom Brady
New England Patriots, 2000-14
53,258 yards, 392 TD, 143 INT, 95.9 rating
Like John Elway or Roger Staubach, a multiple Super Bowl loser famous for his clutch play. Yes, that’s the perfect way to sum up Tom Brady’s career. No bias coming here. Tom Brady’s career has something to please everyone. Unless you’re a Peyton Manning fan apparently. He has career milestones like 350 TDs and 50,000 yards. He has four Super Bowl rings and three Super Bowl MVPs. He’s been regular season MVP twice, he’s thrown for 5,000 yards in a season, 50 TDs in a season, a 117.2 passer rating. Ho Hum. No matter what measure you prefer, Tom Brady is one of the greatest quarterbacks ever to play. Well I appreciate that, though I’m getting a dismissive tone here in paragraph one.
Brady spent a few years throwing to Randy Moss and Wes Welker, and Rob Gronkowski could become the greatest tight end of all time if he stays healthy. But for much of his career, Brady has played with no-name receivers. What does this mean? I have no idea if you’re saying this is good or bad when it really doesn’t even matter. Sometimes he’s had a running game, and sometimes not. Fascinating. For most of the last decade, there have been questions about New England’s defense. 2010-2012 I’ll give you that, but show me a defense without questions. No matter who else is on the team,Bill Belichick and Brady find ways to succeed. Point Brady, right? I’m guessing not. Such dramatic shifts in approach are not unprecedented, but they’re very rare.
I really don’t have anything negative to say about Tom Brady Is that what you’re supposed to do when telling us why you’ve ranked a QB 7th-best all time?, but I suppose I need to explain why he “only” ranks seventh — and in particular, some readers will require me to explain why I rank Brady beneath Peyton Manning. Ah, we’re making this all about Peyton Manning, aren’t we?
Let’s begin with the Manning comparison Because what else is there to talk about here? I think most fans would agree that Brady and Manning have been roughly equal from 2005-14. During those years, Manning was 113-31 as starter, compared to 112-33 for Brady. Each has one Super Bowl victory (and two Super Bowl losses) Peyton Manning lost two Super Bowls? When did this happen?, with one Super Bowl MVP (Brady’s others came prior to ’05) Why are we throwing out the first half of the 2000′s again?. It’s hard to find much difference there Except for playoff records, Brady 12-8, Manning 7-8 with 6 one-and-dones but we’ll ignore that. Likewise with passing stats:
Okay, so we’re agreed that there’s not much difference over the last 10 seasons except for Manning’s consistent underperformance when it counts the most. The question is whether Brady was a greater QB, from 2001-04, than Manning from 1998-2004. Yes, let’s only look at that time period through a statistical lens, when Manning was drafted #1 overall, had a three-year jump on Brady, who of course was drafted #199 overall and wasn’t quite the bred-to-play-NFL-QB that Manning was.
The answer is no. Tom Brady was not as good in his first four seasons as when Manning was hitting his prime with Harrison/James/Clark. Yet he still won three Super Bowls in that time. Interesting. Through ’04, Brady made two Pro Bowls and won two Super Bowl MVP Awards. Only two Pro Bowls!? What a joke! Manning made five Pro Bowls and won two NFL MVP Awards. PRO BOWLS COUNT FOR SOMETHING!!!!! Brady passed for almost 13,000 yards (in four seasons), Manning for almost 30,000 (in seven seasons). Manning had six 4,000-yard seasons (seven seasons), Brady none (again, in four seasons). Manning broke the single-season records for TDs (49) and passer rating (121.1), while Brady’s single-season highs were 28 and 92.6, respectively. Manning had a perfect passer rating (158.3) in a playoff game, which Brady has never done (though he had 141.4 and 137.6), and led a 21-point comeback in the final five minutes of a Monday Night Football game against the defending Super Bowl champions, which no one else has done. Reminds me of a guy who came back from 10 points down in the fourth quarter against the defending Super Bowl champs IN THE SUPER BOWL.
For their careers, Brady has thrown fewer completions, with a lower completion percentage (in three less seasons). Many fewer yards (47 less games) , and fewer yards per attempt (by .3 yards). Fewer touchdowns, and a lower TD% (by .4%). More sacks for more yards, and many more fumbles. Again in three less seasons. He does have a lot fewer interceptions (91 less) and a better INT% Oh well look at that.. He’s less wild than Manning, and he doesn’t seem to get rattled or frustrated as easily. Well I think we can all agree on that.
It’s to Brady’s credit that he’s played well without elite receivers, but it’s also true that he hasn’t looked like the best in the game without weapons like Welker and Gronkowski. I.E. didn’t look his best 2001-2006? That doesn’t apply to Manning, he’s choked in the playoffs with everyone he’s played with. Edgerrin James left, and the Colts won the Super Bowl. Marvin Harrison retired, and Manning won NFL MVP. And then we all said, well, okay, but it’s not like Reggie Wayne is chopped liver. So Manning overcame a career-threatening neck injury, switched to an entirely different team, with entirely new receivers, and set single-season records for yardage and TDs. Eric Decker left in free agency and Welker got suspended, so Manning turned Emmanuel Sanders into a Pro Bowler. 7 catches, 46 yards in the playoff loss. ELITE ALERT! Every receiver Manning plays with turns into a superstar or just Harrison, Wayne and Demaryius but you get the point. I just don’t know how you look at these two QBs and conclude that Brady is more critical to his team than Manning. Is that what we’re measuring now, who’s more critical to their team? It doesn’t match up in the eye test, (which is clearly what you’re relying on the most for these rankings) the passing stats (in Manning’s first 7 years compared to Brady’s first 4), the receivers, (So Manning having better receivers is a point for him? Or is Brady’s lack of receivers a point for him? I’m confused. or the team results. Really? The team results? Really? When Brady missed the 2008 season, the Patriots still went 11-5. When Manning missed the 2011 season, the Colts dropped to 2-14. Everyone’s favorite argument for Belichick > Brady, but the 2008 Pats failed to beat any elite AFC team despite having arguably the best receiving corps in the game. Just because the wheels didn’t completely fall off the bus in 2008 isn’t a reflection on Brady being just a cog. Who would’ve thought “Suck for Luck” would be a positive point for Team Peyton?
Tom Brady has been one of the best QBs in the league for over a decade. I appreciate that. He’s passed for 50,000 yards, nearly 400 TDs, and he’s never thrown 15 or more INTs in any season. He holds several Who has time to look them all up, am I right? Oh I’ll just put them below… postseason records, he’s started in six Super Bowls, quarterbacked four Super Bowl winners, and won three Super Bowl MVPs. He’s an obvious Hall of Famer, a great quarterback by any measure. The idea that he’s the greatest ever — better than his contemporary Manning, or better than fellow four-time champion Joe Montana — I think represents incomplete, over-simplified like only looking at the stats from 2001-2004? analysis or recency bias. The idea that Brady might be the best QB in Super Bowl history is absurd: Joe Montana and Terry Bradshaw, at least, are comfortably comfortably? Really? ahead of him. Brady is still a good player, and it’s likely he will rise on this list before his career is over. Maybe 5 Super Bowls can close the gape between measly Brady and Manning/Montana/Bradshaw?
Tom Brady NFL records
Playoffs (career)
- Most games played – 29[124]
- Most games started for a quarterback – 29
- Most games won as starting quarterback – 21
- Most touchdown passes – 53
- Most yards gained – 7,345
- Most passes completed – 683
- Most passes attempted – 1,085
- Most division titles for a starting quarterback – 12
- Most playoff wins for a starting quarterback – 21
- Most NFL conference championship appearances for a starting quarterback – 9
- Most NFL conference championship wins a starting quarterback – 6
Super Bowl (career)
- Most touchdown passes – 13[125]
- Most yards gained – 1,605
- Most passes completed – 164
- Most passes attempted – 247
- Most passes completed in first half of a single Super Bowl – 20
- Most passes completed in a single Super Bowl – 37
- Most Super Bowl appearances – 6 (tied with Mike Lodish)